Ham's unnatural selection
Michael Suttkus

KEN HAM ON EDUCATION! - Natural selection--it's not evolution!

(6 December 2002)

Ken Ham:    Question: Do evolution and natural selection go hand-in-hand?

Ken Ham
:   Answer: Sadly, most students in schools and colleges believe that natural selection is basically the same as evolution.

That is a shame.  It would be even worse if they believed Ham's nonsense, though.

Ken Ham:   First of all, let me explain that term natural selection. 

This should be good.

Ken Ham:   If two dogs came off Noah's Ark after the Flood,.....

They'd starve to death because there would be no steady food supply.  That's assuming they weren't snapped up by the equally rapidly starving velociraptors before they starved to death.  Of course, since they had to harbour all of the diseases that effect only dogs, I guess they were probably going to die soon anyway.

Ken Ham:   .....eventually a large population of dogs would arise.

Um, no.  They die.  Dead isn't a large population.

Ken Ham:   Now, if some of these dogs separated from the main group.....

The dead dogs are separating?  Is this that life after death I keep hearing about?

Ken Ham:   ....and went off on their own, and because of all the genetic variation that exists in organisms,

What variation?  You've only got four alleles in two dogs.  That's not a lot of genetic variation.

Ken Ham:   over a period of time, it is likely that different combinations....

Combinations of four alleles?  There are only six!

Ken Ham:   ....of genes....

No, Mr Ham, not genes, but alleles All dogs have the same genes.  Two dogs off the ark will result in no genetic diversity and a maximum of four different alleles.  Most of those alleles will vanish within a few generations simply by chance due to the small initial populations.  Not to mention what the founder effect [see note below] is going to do to them.

I mean, it's almost as if being a creationist requires utter and total ignorance of all the relevant sciences.

Ken Ham:   ....would result in various groups - even though all came from the original pair of dogs.

What groups?  You don't have any diversity?

Ken Ham:   Because of environmental pressures, such as temperature, different species of dogs - like long hair and short-haired types - would arise.

From what?  Miracles?

Ken Ham:   Now this has nothing to do with evolution - ....

Sure it does.  Allele frequencies are changing, what's the problem?  Oh, right, Mr Ham, you're also ignorant of the definition of evolution, in addition to genetics, population genetics, and basic biology.

Ken Ham....all that's happening is that because of the tremendous variation in the genes,....

What tremendous variation?  Perhaps I've mistaken your problem Mr Ham .  Perhaps it's basic math that's giving you so much trouble.  Okay, here's the equation:

Two dogs on the ark times two sets of alleles in each dog = four alleles total.


Four is not a "tremendous" number.  Four alleles is not enough variation to account for the modern diversity of dogs.

Ken Ham:   ....different arrangements (or species) result.

Four alleles, six arrangements, no diversity, no new species.  Sorry Mr Ham, but this is just plain silly.

Ken Ham:   This is the opposite of evolution, which requires new information to arise. 

Mr Ham, your situation is requiring new information to arise.  Otherwise, you can't get "tremendous variation" from four alleles.

You now extends the silliness of your "lesson" to include blatant self-contradiction.

Ken Ham:   But this fits exactly with the Creation account in Genesis - God created distinct kinds of animals and plants to reproduce after their own kind.

We're still waiting for a testable definition of "kind", but I think I'll ask someone who doesn't consider four to be tremendous.   Hey, any creationists with basic counting skills want to try answering this?  

Below is a list of things people need to be ignorant of in order to believe your nonsense Mr Ham:

Individual genetics
Population genetics
Basic definitions of biology
Third grade mathematics or maybe basic counting
Basic biology regarding whether dogs can live on good wishes

NOTE:  Founder Effect:   "The founder effect is the reduction of the gene pool and alteration of gene frequencies resulting from the establishment of a new population when a few organisms are isolated from the parental population.

The founder effect is actually an acute occurrence of genetic drift, where changes in the frequencies of
alleles in a population or sub-population occur for reasons other than natural selection."

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